Death Penalty with Chivona R. Newsome

Death Penalty with Chivona R. Newsome

2020 has been an unprecedented and challenging year but hasn’t been all bad. We’ve seen new energy behind the modern civil rights movement and an increase in demands for racial justice. Many activists are using their voices to advocate for ending the death penalty, a punitive method that’s controversial in the criminal justice space. This year, the federal government executed ten people sentenced to the death penalty- the most in a single year since 1896. 

For the final panel of 2020, The Conversationalist Founder and CEO, Sophie Beren, sat down with Chivona R. Newsome and seven Gen Z panelists to discuss the death penalty’s ethics and politics.

Our host Chivona is the Co-Founder of Black Lives Matter Greater NY, is a civil rights leader at the forefront of the New Civil Rights Movement, and is the former Financial Advisor at New York Life. She has dedicated her adult life to the betterment of her community and our nation as a whole. Chivona and the panelists explored both sides of the death penalty resource and how we can come together and create a more equitable criminal justice system.

Do you believe the death penalty is moral? Why or why not?

“I don’t believe that’s moral,” said Autumn Davis, a pre-law student at Stevenson University. “I feel like it should be taken away because it’s just kind of inhumane.” She added that many people serving time for crimes end up showing remorse for their actions. 

Noelle Fitchett is a first-generation college student from Los Angeles, California, studying biochemical and philosophical studies. She doesn’t believe in abolishing the death penalty. “I do think that there are some serious things that we need to take care of in our justice system that disproportionately affect minorities, so I think that we should make some changes,” she said. “I do believe that we should not get rid of it, and that's because I believe that everyone should be able to see justice. I do like the fact that it does deter other potential cases from happening, but I think it should be used in extreme cases.”

Do you think that the death penalty is constitutional?

Alexandra Cohen, a high school senior from Los Angeles, said that while the constitution justifies the death penalty, there’s room in our system to change that. In some states, for example, it has been used less frequently. “Even California has been looking at completely abolishing the death penalty,” she said. “It is justified by our constitution, as long as there's due process, but that doesn't mean it has to stay.”

Noting Alexandra’s point, Chiovana reminded the group that the constitution as it exists is a living document that's meant to be changed over time. 

Brian Stevens famously asked whether or not “we deserve to kill.” What do you think about this?

“I don’t think anyone deserves to die, but I also don’t think anyone deserves the right to continue committing crimes or to continue to kill,” said Zahier Turner in response to the next question. He is a current film and television major at Savannah College of Art and Design.

B.R.E.A.T.H.E Co-Founder Joshua Turner said, definitively, no, and pointed to the history of racism in its application. There's a clear disproportionate rate of black people of color being sentenced to the death penalty. Overwhelming in cases where someone was innocent and executed nine times out of ten, [they] were either black or someone of color.” Additionally, as someone who lost their brother to gun violence, Turner said he would not advocate for the death penalty for the perpetrator because he was put in that scenario by way of systemic oppression. 

On average, 1 in 10 people on death row ends up being exonerated. Why do you think innocent people end up on death row?

Zeb Harshbarger,  the Pennsylvania State Chair of Young Americans for Liberty, said that this speaks to the death penalty’s ineffectiveness. “They're just looking to punish someone rather than rehabilitate them, which should be what our criminal justice system should be about,”

What steps do you think we need to take to keep this from happening?

Ale D'agostino, a third-year at the George Washington University, double majoring in criminal justice and political science with a minor in law and society, said there isn’t one quick fix. However, she said that looking at our justice system’s systemic problems is a solid place to start. “People are starting to address and become more educated about the truth behind our criminal justice system and how it was made a form of slavery to oppress minorities within our community,” she said. “If you say this one thing is going to fix the issue of the death penalty, it's just kind of putting a band-aid on the entire issue.” 

What do you think about the disproportionate representation of Black people on death row?

“It’s concerning,” Zahier said. He added that he wants to look at the patterns to find out what systemic issues might be at play. 

According to a recent Gallup Poll, 60% of Americans believe life in prison is a better punishment for capital crimes than death row. What do you think about this?

As someone who believes in karma, Autumn said she agrees that life in prison is a better punishment because it gives people time to reflect on their actions and show remorse.

Do you think the death penalty should be used on people with intellectual disabilities?

Noelle Fitchett is a first-generation college student from Los Angeles, California, drawing a comparison to her own family. Two of her cousins have severe autism, and she said someone in a situation such as that would benefit from a rehabilitation center. However, she added that IQ is a complicated measure because someone who committed a violent crime while using drugs, for example, might score lower. 

If the death penalty were to be abolished, what would be the appropriate punishment for extreme crime?

I think that the justice system in this country has to focus more on rehabilitation than it has to do with punitive action,” Joshua said. “The purpose of the justice system itself is to serve out justice. Part of justice is ensuring that won't happen again, which does not necessarily mean taking away someone's life but also means building that individual to make that happen.” He added that people commit crimes due to scarcity in communities, and it’s crucial to consider this and systemic racism within the justice system.

Do you think it’s possible for people who commit heinous crimes to be rehabilitated?

Speaking to her work in D.C., D'agostino said it’s important to consider that the success of many of the education programs in prison depends on the wealth of the area and whether the population is male or female. By investing in programs that work for people in prison, it will help with rehabilitation and deterrence. “I'm a big believer that people can change, and we just need to put more funding and more opportunities for individuals actually to have the opportunity to change,” she said.

As someone who believes in limited government, Zed doesn’t think that the government shouldn’t have the authority to decide who lives and who dies. Rehabilitation should always be the ultimate goal. 

In New York State, we spend more money on prison than we do on education. What do you think is the best use of taxpayer money when it comes to capital crime?

Alexandra brought up that it’s more expensive to keep people on death row despite people saying otherwise.“Going back to your point about education, it's best to just invest back into the communities. Spend this money on education and rehabilitation, but even more so invested back into the criminal justice system,” she said. “We live in a racist and classist society, but we have all these taxpayer dollars funding racism and classism. Rather, we can have these funding more qualified public defenders and making people aware of their rights.”

Are there any cases for which you believe the death penalty is justified?

Autumn said she agreed with Zeb that a government doesn’t have the right to decide who should live and die.

Joshua said he does not believe there is any case that the death penalty can be rightfully applied and explained that there is evidence that it does not deter crimes or serve a significant purpose. Additionally, he added that minorities often bear the brunt of its failure. He brought up Brandon Bernard, who the federal government executed on December 9, Dustin Higgs, who was sentenced to death this year, and the “Exonerated Five'' as examples of the injustice of its use.

Have there been any cases this year where the death penalty has been unjustly applied?

As someone who is anti-death penalty, Zahier said he doesn’t think the death penalty is justified in any case. He also added some of his takeaways from the panel. “I've been learning a lot from this panel, specifically from Joshua,” he said. “While I do recognize the disparities and think that it's important to talk about them, I think speaking about the death penalty before speaking about the conditions of those areas might not be that effective because, for me, it seems like it may be just a band-aid solution. It doesn't get rid of the conditions of the area. It doesn't eliminate the trauma and the mental health issues that people are experiencing in these areas. I think that we need to see the conditions of the inner cities, such as Baltimore and Chicago, improve and hold the leaders of those cities accountable.”

How did tonight’s conversation break open your echo chamber?

Alexandra said she learned from each panelists’ perspectives and hoped Gen Z could lead the charge of demanding reform surrounding the death penalty. “If you look at public opinion polls, Americans have gone more and more against the death penalty on both sides of the aisle.”

After the panelists logged off, Chivona joined Sophie for a Q&A. She shared her takeaways from the conversation and spoke about her journey as an activist in the civil rights space and her experience as the Founder of Black Lives Matter Greater NY.

“I'm a former financial advisor, and things usually make a lot of sense to me when I hear statistics,” she Chiovana. “Hearing the numbers thrown out makes me want to fight a little bit harder to abolish the death penalty. Of course, we understand systemic oppression. We understand the wolves that put us there, but I think Autumn kept saying, ‘it's just downright inhumane.’ I don't think that's justice. I don't think that that's rehabilitation.’ Now, I have facts to back up all my arguments, so I'm going home with the pocketbook full of notes.”

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